A Conversation Actively

Reimagining Power, Business, and Belonging

An Interview with Zhou Fang, Founder of Intersectional Group,

by Rose Kaz, Founder of Business 4 Good

At the intersection of systems change and soulful entrepreneurship, two women collaborating in an important conversation, Zhou Fang and Rose Kaz sat down to unpack how abundance thinking transforms not just our mindset, but our business models, leadership style, and the economy we want to build.

Rose Kaz: Zhou, you write in your article, The Abundance Mindset is the Antidote of the Scarcity Mindset, that scarcity isn't always about a lack of money. Many times, it's repackaged, and sold as such but really, it comes down to power and control. 

Since 2017 I've been interviewing entrepreneurs, especially women and founders from underestimated communities, and I believe framing scarcity as such is super powerful. Can you speak more to that?

Zhou Fang: Yes—scarcity often gets misinterpreted as simply being broke or underfunded. But it’s a system of beliefs and behaviors that’s deeply embedded in our workplaces, institutions, and even organizing spaces. Scarcity shows up when decisions are hoarded by a few, when people fear speaking up, and when leadership is based on transactions instead of transformations. Scarcity is how white supremacy culture sustains itself—it conditions people to compete over crumbs rather than co-create whole new systems.

Rose Kaz: Dang! You said it and I feel it, Zhou. We must build new systems because ~ quite literally and physically~ the old ones are crumbling! Right now, I'm focusing directly on ethical AI integration, digital revenue growth, and helping founders build burnout-proof business systems; we pretty much redesign the way they do business by outlining a workflow based on #techfodgood.
You also m ention that “scarcity is a system design.” Love that clarity! What are some signs that someone might be stuck in that design without realizing it?

Zhou Fang: Great question. Scarcity shows up when people internalize limits. Like: “I’m not qualified enough,” “I can’t charge that rate,” or “If I win, someone else has to lose.” It’s in how we replicate hierarchical decision-making or burn ourselves out trying to prove worth. Abundance, by contrast, values people over productivity. It values rest, collaboration, and shared success. 

That’s the design we are shifting towards. 

Rose Kaz: So when you say “people are the wealth,” you're pushing us to move beyond transactional models. And you know I am here for that, Zhou! Other Business 4 Good collaborators like yourself , call this circular business—where systems of care and impact are built into the revenue model. For you, what does it look like to actually lead from that abundance mindset, especially in consulting or community organizing?

Zhou Fang: It looks like redistributing power, not just resources. At Intersectional Group, our facilitation and systems change work is designed to name harm, acknowledge interdependence, and guide teams toward repair. That takes honesty, trust, and a willingness to slow down. We make space for conflict, center joy as strategy, and insist on human-scale collaboration. It's not always easy, in fact, I think we are really beginning to see how intensely deep this work can (& needs) to be. The world is calling for this reclamation. You and I are just catalysts, Rose.
The truth is: we don’t need to fight over scraps. There is enough—there has always been enough.

Rose Kaz: You are absolutely so spot on about that, Zhou. But why do you think the fight over the crumbs started in the first place. It's like it's all one big video game. You really are talking about the notion of not to replacing or diminishing people to numbers, but instead to support the capacity we already have as humans to increase the enjoyment and value of our lived experiences ~ for everyone, not just a select few. 

I have very similar considerations when it comes to ethical uses of tech, especially how we as women in business interact with AI.

How do you recommend a reframe around abundance when building a business in 2025, inevitably with some form of technology, and especially since much of what 'modern tech' is built upon requires a foundation built upon extractive economic models? 

Zhou Fang: First: slow down. Ask, “Who is this tool benefiting?” and “At what cost?” Scarcity makes us chase efficiency at the expense of ethics. But abundance says: we can build tools that care. Technology should be in service to people, not the other way around. That’s what I appreciate about your work—you help entrepreneurs move away from that glorified hustle culture to more of a 'life/ work' balance. I like that we agree on that order, too, Rose. Overall, I say putting strategy, systems, and sustainability in focus together is key. 

Rose Kaz: 1000% agree and I have to say, makes so much sense from your lens of intersectionality, Zhou. I mean, the visual I get when I think of your work guiding people into new ways of leadership are these really cool concentric circles of culture, of heritage and overall, our shared humanity. I understand that to be the heart of your services with Intersectional Group.
I often am heard saying: if the system makes you feel small, build a better one. And you’ve been building fiercely.
Thank you for doing that, Zhou!

Zhou Fang: And so have you! We have to, it's more than a job. I know you know this, Rose. When we lead with abundance, we do more than just grow, we evolve, we transform, and we quite physically become the future. For founders, facilitators, and change makers reading this, please take at least this one thing away with you into your day ~ and if you like, spread the word!
Remember, the antidote to burnout and extraction isn’t doing more. It’s doing things differently.

Take Action

• Read Zhou Fang’s full piece: The Abundance Mindset is the Antidote of the Scarcity Mindset
  
  
• Explore Intersectional Group and their systems cha nge facilitation work.
  
  
• Learn how increasing your own #Tequity supports entrepreneurs in building burnout-proof systems, revenue strategy for sustainable growth and digital toolkits for good.